Early Soviet helmets

[horsesoldier176]

Does anyone have verifiable, definitive evidence on whether the Red Army painted any of its helmet style flat black?

I have two M-36 helmets. One I am certain is a Soviet helmet that never went anywhere but Red Army service, and while that helmet is very dark, it is also clearly a shade of green.

The second is an M-36 that was captured by the Finns in the 39/40 winter war, was cleaned, repainted Finnish flat black, and re-issued to the Finnish Army.

I also have an M-17 Sohlburg, that, while having been made in Finland was issued to the Red Army, as Finland was a part of Imperial Russia/the Soviet Union at the time the M-17s were being produced. Now this M-17 is also the Finnish flat black.

My question is this, would the M-17 have been painted in a shade of green, even if a dark shade of green when issued to the Red Army?

Should I repaint the Finnish captured M-36, back to the Soviet dark green, or leave it flat black, as I intend to use if for Red Army service?

Spaceba

Boridin

[vsahdneek]

Just speculating...

but do you not think that perhaps, although the Sohlburg helmet may have been made while the Finns were part of the Russian Empire, that it was a territorial 'Finn Only' helmet?
You know how the Russians would have looked down on any of their outlying territories...
I tend to doubt any front line Russian troops would have been issued non Russian items for use at the front, more likely the Sohlburgs were used either for

a

territorial Finnish units

b

Russian troops short on Russian gear but deployed in Finland

c

rear area Russian service personell not at any front.

The only head gear I have seen on RKKA troops are the German looking helmet,
the GI looking helmet, the pilotka, the saucer cap, the tanker helmet, the pilot helmet,
the Navy Cracker Jack hat, the Ushanka, the wool liner, and that wool early war pointy Budokova (sp?) with the big red star that looked like the devil designed it! LOL!

I have never seen pix of the Finn helmet being used by Russians, but then again, I am new to this RKKA stuff.... I just tend to think only Finn territorials and rear area units might have used them, but not front line units.... maybe city militia units and air raid units and the like, fire brigades, etc.

Vlad V.

[horsesoldier176]

Well, the first "general" issue helmet used by the Russian (Imperial) Army was the M-1915 French Adrian. There are several examples in former Soviet military museums of those Adrian helmets having been re-done for use by early Bolshevik, and Red Army units. I have seen pictures of Ukrainian Territorial Army units wearing Sohlburg helmets, but since the pictures are poor quality B&W, I can't tell for sure what color the helmets are painted, but they do appear dark in color.

I know that many of the Red Army (Volunteer) units that had been sent to fight on the Republican side of the Spanish Civil War were issued M-1926 French Adrian helmets, that they brought back to the Soviet Union with them, when they returned. Those M-26s were still being used until the units were issued the M-36 (German style as you put it) helmet. When the M-39/M-40 came out, they were (slowly at first) issued to units that may, or may not have previously had helmets issued. There are pictures of some of the units that are falling back in the face of the Fascist onslaught from Barbarossa wear both M-39/40, and M-36 helmets mixed in units.

Of course, all the soft hats, like the pilotka, the budionovka, and the rest were also in evidence.

Again, for all, remember that my impression is not that of a Russian, but an ethnic minority Ukrainian, so while the Russian units, and troops got the new/better gear, we minority troops got what was left, if anything.

Leshod

[horsesoldier176]

Matchlock;

Thanks for the pic, wish it was larger.

I now have a picture of an M-17 Sohlburg, as displayed in an Estonian military museum, and it is clearly a shade of green. Not as dark as the M-36 I have, but not as light as the M-40 I have.

So, now I have to hunt for yet another shade of green to use!

LOL

Leshod

[vsahdneek]

Sr Sgt L Boridin,

I remember seeing some of the Finn Helmets for sale on the Ostfront.com site
with pix

you may want to check them out to check colors...

I do not remember what color they were but I seem to remember that they
we either black, dark grey, or dark green

Vlad I. V.